Running As Fitness Or Survival

SPEAKER_02 0:00

So you're thinking about running, but not sure how to take the first step. My name is Brian Patterson, and I'm here to help. Welcome to Brian's RomPod. Well, welcome to Brian's RomPod, and it's me, your host, Brian Patterson, with some more hints and tips about running. And why do we run? Is it for fitness or is it for something that's much deeper? Because for a lot of people, running isn't just about getting fitter, it's about coping, escaping, resetting, sometimes even surviving. But here's the question: are we using running in a healthy way or is it just avoiding what's really going on? Well, in today's Brian's ROM pod, we're diving into the connection between running and mental health, and with someone who sees us every single day, which is Crystal Aguilar from Senecore. This is a powerful one. So let's

Meeting Crystal From Addiction Treatment

SPEAKER_02 1:09

get into it. Now, before I start, we're going to be talking about maybe some sensitive subjects. So they may not be comfortable for some people, but however, it's really good to hear from an expert on board and to give us an overview of how running is beneficial to one's mental health. So let's give a Brian's ROM pod welcome to Crystal. Thanks for coming on board. And uh thanks for coming onto the show, Crystal. And how are you?

SPEAKER_00 1:40

I'm good, Brian. Thank you for having me. I'm really excited to be here today.

SPEAKER_02 1:45

And I know usually on a like on a running podcast like something like this, um, you know, we're talking about coaches, talking about maybe different ways of training and that kind of thing. But I think increasingly these days, increasingly these days, you know, we can use exercise and running as a really beneficial way of improving someone's mental health. Can you give us a little bit of background as to because I did mention they talk you you work for a company called Senecore. I hope I've got that right. I mean, what what do they do?

Inside Substance Misuse And Co-Occurring Care

SPEAKER_00 2:22

Absolutely. So Sinecore is a substance abuse treatment uh facility, and we have 12 locations across the state of Texas and New Mexico. Right. Uh we treat uh adults and youth um and uh across the spectrum, right? We have with raw management, intensive residential, medication-assisted treatment, we have sober living, um, and we we treat everything. Right. Um and as you know, we're in an opiate epidemic. So anything and everything we treat at the facility.

SPEAKER_02 2:55

Right. Okay. So how did I mean how did you sort of get into this space? Was this something you you studied um at a degree level at college, or were the were you doing something completely different?

SPEAKER_00 3:10

Uh actually, I got into the field accidentally. Oh right. Um I I uh received my master's in forensic psychology, and I wanted and and it had to do uh it surrounded mental health and it surrounded working with uh um diagnosis of you know, I wanted to work with criminals, the severely sick, and I could not find a job. I kept hearing the same thing. You have the degree and you have the grades, however, you do not have the hands-on experience. So I send my resume to the organization, and I interviewed on uh I sent it on a Wednesday, I interviewed on a Thursday, and I got extended an offer on a Friday. And I started that following Monday.

SPEAKER_02 4:01

Monday. Oh, right, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:02

And I I did not have any experience in the field of addiction whatsoever. Uh, however, some of it resonated with what I went to school for, and it it was very similar. Mental health aspect of it and the substance abuse aspect of it.

SPEAKER_01 4:20

Right.

SPEAKER_00 4:20

And I was given a caseload after three days because uh the person that previously had the caseload uh was terminated and I had no idea what I was doing.

SPEAKER_01 4:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:32

However, I fell in love with the field of substance abuse and addictions because um the individuals were so they were needing something to believe in. They were so broken when they went into uh our treatment center and they needed hope.

SPEAKER_01 4:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:50

They um they needed they needed something. And I I thought to myself, this is something I can do because we all I think come across some sad times, and so we all can relate and empathize or sympathize, and and I thought this is for me. And then I I always say I became a wall fixture, and 10 years later, here I am.

SPEAKER_02 5:12

Yeah. So is it a we will kind of get into how this kind of connects with with running because is the Seneca sort of like a privately funded company, um an organization which is which is in this particular space?

SPEAKER_00 5:31

Or we um we take uh various funding sources, uh, so it is uh privately funded. However, we take um we receive funding from you know the government, we take funding from donors, we take funding from community partners, uh individuals who are unable to pay for treatment, receive assistance from you know the state, also the funding that we receive from our partners in the community assist with that. Um take insurance, uh, we take private pay. We have a whole variety of funding sources. So we always say we um have someone, we have something for everybody.

SPEAKER_02 6:19

Right. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 6:20

However, we take everybody.

SPEAKER_02 6:22

Okay, okay. And so you kind of take uh people or patients or cases, whatever you you call, and then you kind of take them through this roadmap in terms of treating uh a particular individual for whatever it is, whether it be substance abuse or whether it be mental health issues. Is that correct?

SPEAKER_00 6:43

We do. So a person comes in and and and right right now we're seeing a lot of co-occurring, and the co-occurring is they do have the substance abuse and they have the mental health component. And so it's one of those things uh, is it the the chicken before the uh chicken before the ankle?

SPEAKER_01 7:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:02

You know, it's one of those discussions. Um and and so we first tackle the substance abuse because we don't know are they using to not have to not feel the way the symptoms of mental health make them feel, or are they using because they have the mental health? Right. So but we we first tackle the symptom, we first tackle the substance abuse. Right. Because that's that's essentially the poison in the body and the poison in the brain.

SPEAKER_02 7:39

Okay, yeah, yeah, I understand.

SPEAKER_00 7:41

And then after that, we see what do we need to do to address the mental health component.

SPEAKER_01 7:48

Right.

unknown 7:48

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 7:49

We do a two-fold treatment plan and then we decide what's the next course of action.

SPEAKER_02 7:55

Right. Okay.

Crystal’s Running Story And Community

SPEAKER_02 7:56

So bringing it round, I mean, because uh this is a you know, predominantly a running pro podcast, did I mean, how is ha has running been sort of part of your life beforehand, or is it you know, b before you kind of were took this on as a job, or could you sort of see the the benefits and all as um maybe potentially a solution for people who are going through this particular roadmap?

SPEAKER_00 8:24

Uh both.

SPEAKER_02 8:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:26

Um both and and all of it. So I started um in cross country when I was uh in school uh and it continued through high school. Um then I um I have heart disease.

SPEAKER_01 8:40

So I have heart disease.

SPEAKER_00 8:44

Uh I uh I also have a pacemaker.

SPEAKER_02 8:47

Oh right. Oh, interesting.

SPEAKER_00 8:49

When I in 2017, but I started having issues with that throughout the years. But I started running then and I continue to run um competitively in 2006. Right. Um there in corpus um in in races, in local races. And I also started raising money for St. Jude Children's Hospital. Um and I would do big races and raise money for them. Um but what I would do is I would I I was I was a loan runner. So what I would do is I would go out to these races, run, and then as soon as the race was over, I would leave. I wouldn't talk to anybody, I was very shy. Yeah, um and there was this really big running community. Anywhere you go, there's a really big running community. However, I was always a shy individual.

unknown 9:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:45

And then I started this one person introduced himself and he says, I see you out of here all the time. And he said, You know, my name's John. Yeah, I see how fast you are.

SPEAKER_01 9:56

Right.

SPEAKER_00 9:57

And then we became friends and he introduced me to everyone. And then I became a social butterfly and I started meeting everybody.

SPEAKER_01 10:06

Right.

SPEAKER_00 10:06

Um, and I became an advocate for running because that's that's what I use through some of the hardships that I went through as far as my medical condition and things like that. Um, I started seeing the benefits of it. Um but I also encourage others. Um, it it it has so many benefits, right? And I think and and we can go into it more, but I think there's so many misconceptions of running.

SPEAKER_02 10:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:32

But it has so many benefits to it.

SPEAKER_02 10:34

Yeah, because I see there that obviously I mean, I get told that, you know, like when I go running in our local community, and then people, you know, if I people will say, Oh, I saw you running the other day, or something like that, sometimes it can be a good conversation opener. Or like you said, it can be the opportunity for someone who isn't very um outgoing um for you to maybe join, like you said, to to join a community of runners and to help someone's confidence, maybe, you know, like like you s like you say. Um and from there, no doubt, as you can see, that you already noticed that there are sort of already, you know, uh a connection in terms of you know elevating one's mental health there all already.

SPEAKER_00 11:27

Yes, it does. And so what you know that that's the that's the beauty of running. Um it for me, the reason that I like to run by myself is because I use it as a reset. Anything that's going on in my life personally, professionally, uh if if my brain feels bogged down, if I feel that life is heavy, yeah. I go for a run regardless of the distance, if I'm going to pray about it, if I'm going to listen to music and get lost in the music and get lost in the scenery. Yeah. Um it's one, it's free. Running is free. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 12:07

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 12:08

Um by the end of the run, I'm so mentally tired and physically tired and exhausted from the run that for me, I'm like, what what was what was bothering me?

SPEAKER_02 12:21

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 12:22

It's that it's that type of, or if if I I always used to say I talked to my higher power, I I prayed about it. Yeah, I feel a sense of clarity at the end of my running.

SPEAKER_01 12:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:35

So that that's the beautiful thing about running is that that that's that's for me being a lone runner. But when you you talk to other people for who have difficult health or they're they isolate or something, uh go find a running group. They're so welcoming. Yeah. Uh there's a running group for everybody, whether you feel like you're a slow runner, a walker, um, you want to take your pets out there. Everybody is so welcoming. You're never gonna find uh a running group or a person that says, oh no, you're not fast enough, or oh no, you know, you're not welcoming. It it it's so welcoming that if you feel you don't belong, you're gonna belong in a running group somewhere and you're gonna make friends.

SPEAKER_02 13:20

Yes, that's that's very true. Do you I mean in your experience, I mean, like you you you've obvious you've you've we've you've just there you've you've talked about so many benefits and maybe we can you know explore that a little bit

Why Anxiety Feels Worse After Covid

SPEAKER_02 13:32

more. But I mean, in your experience over the last sort of 20 years, um, do you think people are becoming more anxious um these days? Or is it very is it it it hasn't really changed that much, but maybe people are, you know, just worrying about different things these days?

SPEAKER_00 13:55

I think I think there's um there I think ever since COVID, there's there's a myriad of things that people are experiencing in their life. Um, you know, the cost of living has increased uh ever since COVID, people isolated um the use of substances, especially alcohol, has increased ever since COVID because we had to uh quarantine. And then during the time of quarantine, alcohol was still available, even though we could quarantine, and so people's drinking increased during that time as well, and that's unhealthy. Um so you couldn't be out, but you could still drink.

SPEAKER_02 14:33

Yeah. Um domestic abuse as well.

SPEAKER_00 14:37

Exactly. Abuse cases went up, child abuse cases went up. Um, and so all those things are factors that still to this day you see um play a role. Even to this day, that started during COVID. And mental health across the board skyrocketed when COVID first hit about 2020. Yeah. We're six years, then we're six years later. Um, and I think it's because people didn't know how to cope with being isolated for so even in that short amount of time. And so, yeah, a lot of those factors are still um prevalent in the the coping skills, you know, mental health is still very taboo. Um someone uh people don't readily talk about it. And getting help is still very hush hush, you know. Um it's not it's not something that if you do talk about it, uh, oh yeah, let's go to therapy or or go get the medications that you need. It it's seen as like, oh, you have mental health. It's very looked down upon. Yeah. There's still a stigma with it, just the same as um addiction. Yeah. Which is why people keep it to themselves.

SPEAKER_02 15:58

Yeah.

AI Relationships And Growing Isolation

SPEAKER_02 15:59

And also with the various revelations from, you know, about AI recently, you know, the dangers of AI, that kind of thing. Can you see that down the line on people getting very anxious about that?

SPEAKER_00 16:14

Oh, absolutely. Um, and and you know, the the thing with AI that I was having discussions about with uh a doctor, actually, who is a therapist and some of his patients, is that it's contributing to the isolation as people are using AI for relationships, an individual who's interested in a person who isolates. Well, instead of using coping skills and saying, hey, maybe go out and meet people and make a friend and become social, yes, well, he's there they use AI to just that is their relationship. You're seeing people who isolate them.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_00 16:57

Yeah, and then that suffices and uh reinforces their isolation because what do they need to go out for? AI is their person, AI is their comfort, yeah. But that contributes to their mental health in a whole other perspective, and that just opens the door to chaos because what is AI gonna do? AI is gonna be fictitious and feed you what you want to hear. Hear.

SPEAKER_02 17:21

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 17:22

Where people will that's not how real people So what do you think?

SPEAKER_02 17:27

I mean, we talked about those some of the benefits of of running, um, and but what do you think is maybe going on underneath in terms of let's say so when you go out running, you got the opportunity to a meet a physical person or they they're able to see you, and also I mean, uh in terms of you know your your your your background, what you know, is it the endorph you're getting the endorphins, is it going outside, is it how that's helping you to elevate your confidence and like I said, make you um feel that trying not to s to I don't know how can I put it, try not to be so insular and think about all the bad things, and then it just gives be a much more positive outlook.

The Upside Of Running For Mental Health

SPEAKER_00 18:18

Yeah, so there's the you know, just the way there's a uh a positive side to everything, there's a uh a negative side to everything. You know, the positive side to running is you you get out, um, you meet people, you can join a run club, yeah, you can be part of something. Um run clubs are like families. Um, so you can be you can outside of running, you can all get together and do social things, you know, dinners, breakfasts. Yeah. Uh it's it's a social, it's a social gathering of the sort. And um, you can set goals for yourself. Okay, I I did this one mile, you know, run. I can do two miles, I can do three miles. So you set goals for yourself, you know, personal, personal records, you know, guitars as like to call them, and then you you continue working from there. And you said, okay, well, I did a 5k, well, maybe I could do a 10K, and then maybe I can work for the half marathon. And that makes you feel good. And so then after that, maybe you want, maybe it's a um, maybe you would like to lose weight. And with cardio, that's good, that's gonna be a given, right? You're gonna you're gonna lose pounds as you continue to run. Um so and then, and then there's the there's the mental health component, you know, being out and and running, whether you want to run by yourself and listen to music and get lost in your thoughts, or you want to talk with other people and talk about your thoughts. You're gonna find somebody who's like-minded, like yourself, or maybe give you a different perspective. And you might meet either a soulmate, uh best friend. You're gonna meet someone in the running community that's that you're gonna associate with or that that's gonna be like you, that you can

When Running Turns Into Another Addiction

SPEAKER_00 20:02

um, you know, that you you can say, okay, these are my people. Um the downside of it though is sometimes, you know, you can over-train. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 20:12

Yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_00 20:13

And um you can, and now, you know, and and realistically now peptides is a is a huge thing right out right now, peptides and losing weight and thing. Um, and people are using that and saying, Well, I wanna, they're they're already skinny and so they're unhealthy.

SPEAKER_02 20:30

Yes, that's true. That's very true. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:33

They can say, Well, you know what, I want to be faster. And if I want to be faster, I gotta be skinnier.

SPEAKER_02 20:38

Skinnier, yeah. That's right.

SPEAKER_00 20:39

And so they think they put that mentality and or people with um addiction are what they're doing is they're saying, you know what, I don't need to work a program of recovery. I just want to run. And if I run, that helps me um get lost in my thoughts. Right. So I'm gonna run. That helps me. Anything else, like anything else, all my problems are fine as long as I run. So I'm gonna run 20 miles, I'm gonna run 10 miles, and as long as I run, I'm fine. Right. But what happens if they're not running?

SPEAKER_01 21:15

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:16

Um, so there's always a downside, um, the that very competitive aspect. Like anything else, running can become an addiction. It can become very unhealthy. Um, running is cardio, right? So you have to eat, right? Um you have to put, you know, carbs, you have to sleep, get enough sleep. Um, if you don't do that, your body's like a machine. It will tell you, it will show you, hey, I'm gonna fail you. Yeah. And and you're prone to injuries. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 21:48

Exactly. My point, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:49

Yeah. You'll get shin splints, yeah, you'll get plantar fishitis, yeah. You'll get uh all kinds of things.

SPEAKER_02 21:55

You have to invest in Achilles, tendinitis, that kind of thing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:00

Um your hip, anything that has to do with your leg, if you have something with your ankle, it goes to your knee, anything with your knee goes to your hip. Um, and then it travels.

Injury Spirals And Finding A Pivot

SPEAKER_02 22:10

Um so And and also when you're injured, what you're gonna do, you're not gonna be running when you're injured, and obviously that kind of feels feeds rather that negativity that you have may have had beforehand.

SPEAKER_00 22:25

Exactly. And it could and then it can become a cycle. If you're injured, then you start going, you could experience depression because you start, what else can I do? Yeah. Whereas if you are an experienced athlete, you think, okay, well, I'll just pivot and I'll go to swimming.

SPEAKER_01 22:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:41

Or I'll just pivot and I'll go to cycling. Yeah, because a a person knows that. But if you're not, if you're new into it, you start thinking, well, now what? And you could get depressed because it is depressed, not being able to run. There are a lot of us runners who think running is life. And without it, what am I gonna do?

SPEAKER_02 23:01

So especially if you've got that sort of addictive personality that you've chosen this exercise to get out of a particular uh situation you're in, and then suddenly you find that you're incapacitated for whatever reason, and then again, it's you've got that addictive personality, you could either be you know, it's one step forward, two step back, as it were.

SPEAKER_00 23:26

Absolutely. They think, well, you know, I'm injured now, I might as well give up.

SPEAKER_01 23:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:32

Whereas, you know, they don't find an alternative or think, how else can I be productive? How you know that it it could set a person back both physically, mentally, and just overall. Um, and and that that's also a downside.

unknown 23:45

Yeah.